Tag Archives: Toronto condominiums
Luxury condo glut about to flood Toronto housing market
Andrea Hopkins, Reuters
Five months after buying one of Toronto’s new luxury hotel condominiums, Oliver Baumeister is girding for a glut of suites like his to hit the market as the biggest names in the hotel business open hundreds of units in Canada’s largest city.
Baumeister, himself a real estate agent, is in no rush to sell. When Toronto’s untested market for five-star condo living absorbs the surplus — say by 2016 — he intends to offload his sky-high unit for a tidy 20% profit, and look for his next Canadian real estate investment.
“A bunch of it will sit for a while and it will take time to sell,” said Baumeister, who has been buying Toronto condominiums with his brother for the past four years.
“But we bought it with the belief that the Toronto hotel condo market definitely has a future. When we sell, hopefully … we’ll see about a 20% profit.”
The model of ultra-fine condos attached to luxury hotels isn’t new — cities like Hong Kong and New York are full of them.
But Toronto, a relatively small city with no five-star hotel condominiums a year ago, is coming to the game late but with a vengeance.
By the end of this summer Toronto will have four such projects, as Four Seasons, Ritz Carlton, Trump and Shangri-La open massive towers in a city where a red-hot market for all types of housing has brought rising concern about a real estate bubble.
The granite-and-glass towers, including two of Canada’s tallest residential buildings, are opening in quick succession, adding hundreds of hotel rooms and more than a thousand condominiums just as Canadian housing hype hits a fever pitch.
Comment: And hype is exactly that – hype. Chuck D told us not to believe it, he was right.
Signs of success are mixed. None of the four projects, whose condos cost from just under $1-million to $28-million, has sold out, and the push by developers to sell their remaining units before a resale market kicks in has the feel of a ticking time bomb.
Comment: What push? They all want to sell their units, as with any development regardless of cost. Trump has been selling for almost 10 years now, of course they want to be done.
“I think any developer has concerns about that,” said Howard Tikka, director of marketing Talon International Development Inc, which is developing the Trump property.
“If you have units left to sell, and people are taking them to market to resell, there is just not a whole lot you can do about it.”
With the Ritz Carlton already open and the other three not-fully-sold projects due to hit the market this summer, the developers will compete with sellers of their own luxury condos as speculators and investors try to cash in.
Comment: ASSUMED speculators and investors. Some may have just changed their mind, others may need to liquidate for financial reasons. We have no idea how many will come up for sale, nor the reasons why.
While all four projects boast paper profits for early investors, the simultaneous sale of dozens — perhaps hundreds — of exquisite suites may prove too much of a good thing.
“I think on the luxury side, the market has already peaked,” said Don Campbell, president of the Real Estate Investment Network, an author who invests his own money and advises others about buying into Canada’s housing market.
Campbell said six groups identified the same hole in Toronto’s luxury market about 10 years ago. Four projects went ahead, and all of them are coming on line at the same time.
Comment: But the true measure of this market segment is not what happens in a few months – it is what happens over the next decade, or more. Any time you have multiple instances of the same thing coming on line at the same time there can be issues. Just wait it out and things will settle.
TROUBLES AT TRUMP
The Trump project, a 65-story paragon of glitz with a “champagne and caviar” theme, appears the most troubled. Plagued by bad press, construction delays, disgruntled buyers and a hybrid model of residences and pooled hotel condos, the project has the largest portion of unsold units despite being the first to open its sales office, in 2004.
Talon said 80% of the tower’s 379 units have sold, powered by the hotel condos, currently priced from $967,000. But 40% of the residential condos, priced between $2.3-million and $6.3-million, remain unsold.
It said Trump has the most left to sell because it has twice the number of units as competitors at the Four Seasons and Ritz Carlton, and focused first on selling its hotel rooms.
The Ritz Carlton, Four Seasons and Shangri-La projects have kept their condo and hotel rooms separate. The condo owners have access to hotel amenities but no direct stake in its operation.
Trump, on the other hand, is trying to sell all its hotel rooms to private investors as condos. Owners can live in the suites, or put the rooms into a rental pool and take a cut of income from the hotel guests staying there.
The business structure means buyers of the pooled hotel condo units are subject to commercial tax rates rather than lower residential rates, and the bar for financing is higher.
Comment: Which is one of the major problems they are having. No matter how much money you have, when your property tax bill is 9x higher than you expected, you get mad. And some of those tax bills are $80,000 or even $100,000.
“I called every major lender regarding Trump, and the only one I could find that was willing to finance was HSBC,” said Callum Ross mortgage consultant Jason Friesen.
Comment: Because our banks are getting out of the condo/hotel game. I helped a client buy on Victoria street a few years back, in a mixed building. He barely got CMHC to back him – in fact I was told that his was the last mortgage insured for that type of project. So yeah, there is certainly a problem getting financing for combined buildings.
“There were some units that had $20,000 (annual) property taxes for an $800,000, or 1,500 square foot, unit because it was zoned commercial. So lenders wouldn’t touch it.”
Comment: As I said, imagine the bills on the big ones!
Real estate lawyer Bob Aaron, who represents “a handful” of disgruntled Trump buyers, said some are trying to get out of their contract or walking away from $250,000 down payments.
“The monthly costs are too high, or they realized too late that they had overpaid, or can’t finance it, or didn’t realize they were getting into a business venture superimposed on property ownership,” he said.
Comment: And if no one learned from the fiasco that was 1 King West, then it is their own fault. This sort of thing was huge news, anyone with any interest in real estate should have known about it. And it should have prompted a lot of questions that would have avoided the issues here.
“They had very smooth sophisticated marketing, and I think buyers were dazzled by being partners with Donald Trump.”
Comment: I don’t know about that. I had an interested client years back and I had extensive discussions with them. I was never dazzled, nor were they ever duplicitous. If buyers did not do their due diligence, then they have no one to blame but themselves.
The American property mogul has licensed the Trump name to the project but has no part in owning or operating the tower.
FLIPPERS AND FOREIGN BUYERS
The debate about who is buying them dogs Toronto’s condo boom. There are no figures for foreign buyers in Canada, which is seen as a financial safe haven amid global woes, but talk of affluent Asian, European and Middle Eastern investors abounds.
Comment: Tridel says that only 5% of their Toronto buyers are foreign, a figure I imagine to be fairly representative of the market as a whole. And the Association of Condominium Managers says that 22% of units are rented out. So yes, there are actual figures. The problem is that they don’t jibe with the catastrophe stories most of the press is writing.
Janice Fox, director of sales at the Four Seasons, estimates 30 to 40% of buyers there have been foreign, but she said they intend to live in the units, at least part of the year.
Comment: The ultra-luxury market is NOT representative of the Toronto condo market as a whole.
Some 90% of the Four Seasons 210 condos have been sold, including one last year for $28-million, the highest price ever paid for a Canadian condominium. That buyer is foreign, but the family intends to move to Toronto, Fox said.
The resale market may be a gold mine for early buyers, as some prices have doubled since the first investors signed on in 2004 or 2007.
Comment: Most Toronto properties have doubled since 2004, new or resale.
“There’s been a big gain in price. There’s probably a small group who bought in 2007 who has had a massive gain and want to cash out on that,” said Michael Braun, marketing manager for Shangri-La developer Westbank Corp.
With more than 50 of 393 units remaining to be sold before August, when contracts close and buyers can start re-selling, Braun says it could take until early 2014 before Shangri-La sells all of its units.
Realtors estimate between 10% and 20% of pre-construction sales are made by investors who intend to flip the units as soon as the deals close.
Comment: Which Realtors are those? Funny you don’t quote any of them…
The Ritz Carlton, open since mid-2011, is a cautionary tale of the risk of resale. More than 90% of its 159 units have been sold — but nearly two dozen are back on the resale market, diluting the sales power of the developer.
“I think the values have been hurt at the Ritz, where you’ve had some powers of sale,” said real estate agent Brian Persaud, referring to forced sales due to mortgage default. “That’s going to harm the value, definitely.”
Comment: People forget that these luxury projects are the first ones in Toronto. And they all started around the same time and finished around the same time. After this initial buzz, things will slow down. Any new ultra luxury projects will be single events.
As the summer openings of the three other projects approach, developers and investors seem to have one eye on the clock and one eye on historically low interest rates, desperate to sell before the talk of a bursting Toronto condo bubble comes true.
Comment: THERE IS NO BUBBLE.
“There has to be a correction — but hopefully not within a year …. it is scary,” said a Toronto banker who bought one of the Shangri-La luxury units in 2007 and hopes to resell at a 15% profit as soon as he can.
Comment: No, there does not HAVE to be a correction.
“Obviously there is going to be a spiral-down effect (when all the units hit the market) but that is to be expected,” said the banker, who bought the unit with his parents and declined to be named to protect their privacy. “At worst we’ll break even.”
Comment: So this buyer is looking to make 15% and the one above is expecting 20%. Why does this not sound so bad?
Real estate agent Persaud is more sanguine. He believes all the luxury condos will be sold, especially once resale values stabilize and buyers can get a first-hand look at the finished five-star product.
“I don’t think they’ll be vacant forever,” he said. “Eventually the market will catch up to it, but there is going to be blood in the streets for a while.”
Comment: That is a dramatic way to say it, but yes…
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Contact the Jeffrey Team for more information – 416−388−1960
Laurin & Natalie Jeffrey are Toronto Realtors with Century 21 Regal Realty.
They did not write these articles, they just reproduce them here for people
who are interested in Toronto real estate. They do not work for any builders.
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Condo bump in Toronto could signal overbuilding
By Jay Bryan, The Gazette
A big jump in home construction last month has reheated concerns by some analysts over the prospect of an overheated housing market. But the problem is highly localized, specifically among Toronto condominiums.
That’s because the March data on housing starts showed a sharp divide between Toronto condos and the rest of the market. While the number of starts jumped by an unexpected five% across Canada in a market that was expected to be roughly unchanged, “this was pretty well entirely Toronto condos,” said economist Robert Kavcic at BMO Capital Markets.
Construction of Ontario multiple-unit buildings – mainly condos in Toronto – shot up by more than 50% between February and March, while the rest of the nationwide market remained little changed from its average pace over the past 12 months.
“Canada’s condo craze kicked into even higher gear during March, and this is bound to feed concerns about overbuilding,” said Scotia Capital economists Derek Holt and Dov Zigler in a note to clients.
Holt and Zigler expressed concern that the number of unsold new condominium units has been rising sharply.
Other analysts noted that the condo boom isn’t evident in other big markets, so there’s little reason to see a widespread problem in the housing market. Montreal condo starts. for example, have trended down in recent months
In Toronto, however, there are lots of anecdotal reports of international investment money flowing into Toronto’s condo market as a refuge from the low investment returns and economic uncertainties recently dogging many other countries, noted economist David Onyett-Jeffries at the Royal Bank.
On top of this, the huge jump in March construction is likely the result of exceptionally good weather and the fact that condo construction activity can move sharply up in any month, that sees a single big new project.
Comment: It dropped in February then jumped up again to make up for it.
The recent level of condo starts in Toronto is creating strains in the market, believes Craig Alexander, chief economist at the TD Bank. Although he doesn’t see it as the kind of speculative mania that would foreshadow a serious meltdown, there does seem to be a surge of supply that will be hard to absorb.
Comment: The same supply people have been worrying about since 2003. It always finds a way to get absorbed, not to worry. The key is that there is no speculation problem.
Alexander agrees with Onyett-Jeffries that international investors look like a large factor, but he thinks they’re mostly looking for long-term rental income in a world where gains on financial markets have been uncertain at best, not the overnight capital gains one seeks by flipping units in a speculative market.
Comment: Yes, the rental market is now the condo market. There are no new rental buildings being built, so investors are supply the rental inventory with condos. And it seems to be working well.
Still, Alexander believes, the vigour of Toronto condo construction has turned this market, along with the painfully high-priced Vancouver housing market, into the high-risk neighbourhoods of Canadian real estate.
Comment: Vancouver, maybe, as we watch prices drop. But Toronto is still a LONG way from that.
The problem with having an skyrocketing, investor-driven condo market, he notes, is that all the units now being built could flood the market, leaving some investors unable to find tenants and inclined to sell. If many sell at once, it could easily trigger a decline in all condo prices.
Comment: Yes, they “could” be a problem. But that is only “if” they all decide to sell at once. And since they are buying them to hold them and rent them for the long term, there is no pressure to sell. And if some start to sell, the smart ones will hold theirs and not flood market, not pushing prices down. Keep them and the panic subsides and the prices stay level or rising. And I have a feeling that most of the people with buckets of money to spend here have a brain – how else did they make the money in the first place?
That probably won’t be catastrophic, since Toronto’s demand for housing is strong enough to sop up the excess units over the coming decade, but it could lead to bigger-than-average price declines over the next few years. Alexander estimates that the national home market is already overpriced by an average of 10 to 15%.
Comment: What is an “average” price decline? Seeing as we have not seen prices go down since 1995, we have no idea what that would be. And even if there is a period of decline, it will not last and prices will rise again. Even in the chaos of 1989, prices rose 127% in 15 months, then crashed. They fell from 1990 to 1996. But then back up again, way up. So if prices drop, again the smart investors will hold their units and wait for prices to rise again before selling. If enough people do that, prices stop dropping as supply dries up. And we are right back where we are right now. And heck, think about it. If prices were to start dropping now, people would go insane to buy. There are a lot of people who have bought into the false belief that prices will fall. They are all out there, waiting… and as soon as prices start to fall, they are going to pounce. And push prices right back up again. Never mind that there are still a lot of buyers out there – about 10x as many in the low-rise sector. And with 100–150,000 people entering the GTA housing market every year, there is a lot of buying pressure across the spectrum.
His forecast, though, is that most of Canada will be able to back off from today’s high home prices with minimal damage. Across the country, he thinks prices will be roughly flat this year, then drop perhaps eight to 10%, perhaps a bit less, over the following two years as rising mortgage interest rates squeeze demand.
Comment: Yeah… no. That is not going to happen. Interest rates were 5–6% until the past year or so – and still we set sales and price records. Vancouver is dropping, but there are bidding wars in Halifax, Toronto… even in Winnipeg. That is certainly not the start of a price-dropping trend. And if interest rates rise, that means the economy is doing well. Which means more people have jobs and more people have more money. Which means they can afford to buy houses.
Under this scenario, the fall-off in demand would be gradual enough that price declines would have to offset only about two-thirds or less of today’s overvaluation. Rising average incomes would fill the rest of the gap.
Comment: So what is this overvaluation? How much is it? Why are they overvalued? Oh right, no one ever has an answer. They just say it and expect you to believe it. I don’t… And why would prices drop if incomes are rising? That means they have more money – and can afford higher prices.
The big exceptions are likely to be in the Toronto condo market and the Vancouver market for both condos and single-family homes. Vancouver has actually cooled recently, but remains the highest-priced market in the country.
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Contact the Jeffrey Team for more information – 416−388−1960
Laurin & Natalie Jeffrey are Toronto Realtors with Century 21 Regal Realty.
They did not write these articles, they just reproduce them here for people
who are interested in Toronto real estate. They do not work for any builders.
—————————————————————————————————–
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Falling condo glass may be underreported, councillor suggests
Carys Mills and Julien Russell Brunet – Globe and Mail
Worries about shattering glass and exactly whom residents of Toronto condominiums should turn to when any structural issues arise kept the phones ringing at one city councillor’s office Thursday.
“It’s brought people out of the woodwork,” said downtown councillor Kristyn Wong-Tam.
Her ward contains some of the five condos that have recently showered some city streets with glass. She called for a broad investigation earlier this week after a woman was injured by balcony glass that fell from the 31st floor of one building.
Since then, Ms. Wong-Tam (Toronto Centre–Rosedale) said residents from inside and outside her ward have alerted her to previously unreported instances of glass breaking and other condo problems.
She and her staff fielded about 50 calls Thursday, many of them concerning the glass issue. Some instances of shattering glass had gone unreported because there’s no streamlined process or contact at the city, she said.
“There’s a sense of confusion. When your balcony glass breaks, who do you contact?” she said.
Provincially, Trinity-Spadina MPP Rosario Marchese is calling for stricter condo legislation overall.
“There is a lack of protection for the more than one million condo owners in Ontario,” he said in a statement late Thursday.
The falling glass has sent reverberations through the condo and glass industries.
Barry Fenton, president and chief executive officer of Lanterra Developments, said the company is taking steps to immediately remove tempered glass from its three buildings on Bedford Road, Grenville and Grosvenor streets. Seven of nine balcony-glass incidents that have occurred since last December were at those buildings, according to city officials.
Furthermore, Mr. Fenton said Lanterra would replace the glass with laminated glass, “a better product,” and will use it for all future projects.
All the falling glass incidents involved tempered glass rather than the more expensive laminated glass, which is similar to the kind used in car windshields.
“We’re reacting to an industry issue that has arisen,” Mr. Fenton explained. “We had two ways to deal with it. One was to replace the tempered glass with tempered glass. And the other was to step up … even at our cost.”
While Mr. Fenton said he had yet to receive cost estimates, according to Doug Perovic, a professor of materials science and engineering at the University of Toronto, laminated glass is 50 to 200 per cent more expensive than tempered glass.
Mr. Fenton said Lanterra would be using Toro Aluminum Railings Inc., the same company that supplied the original glass, to carry out the replacements.
And although the problem of falling balcony glass from Lanterra buildings is “a Toro issue,” he said, “we haven’t lost confidence in Toro as a company.”
The people who supply glass to developers are also grappling with the problem.
“It’s big news around everybody in the industry,” said Frank Fulton, board president of the Ontario Glass and Metal Association. He said it’s unlikely there would be so many incidents unless the glass was attached improperly – with too much pressure on the edges, where tempered glass is weakest.
Glass experts say impurities in the glass can also lead to spontaneous breakage.
Still, Mr. Fulton said it’s “scary” because tempered glass is used so widely due to its low cost. “I would venture to say they’re 98 per cent tempered glass,” he said of balconies and other parts of Toronto building exteriors such as sliding doors. “There’s millions of pieces of them.”
On Thursday, the city ordered that engineering reports from Lanterra and the other developers with falling glass be submitted to the city by Aug. 31, according to Ms. Wong-Tam. Once they’re in, the developers will have 10 days to come up with an action plan, she said, while city staff pore over the reports.
She said there’s still a need to discuss updating the province’s building code and other issues with upper levels of government. On the local level, she said, a central reporting phone line for condo issues should be considered.
While anxieties mount, Prof. Perovic cautions against blowing the problem out of proportion.
“In terms of statistical significance of failure, this is minuscule compared to the number of windows that are made and installed.”
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Contact the Jeffrey Team for more information – 416−388−1960
Laurin & Natalie Jeffrey are Toronto Realtors with Century 21 Regal Realty.
They did not write these articles, they just reproduce them here for people
who are interested in Toronto real estate. They do not work for any builders.
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